Episode 56: Nonprofit Websites and Capitalizing on Websites for Events - Part 1

Jeff: Welcome to Elevate Your Event, your favorite podcast for transforming fundraising events. Join us weekly for expert tips and creative ideas to make your next event a standout success. Want to see a significant increase in donations and engagement on your nonprofit website? In this episode, we delve into the game-changing strategies for nonprofit websites featuring insights from Monica Pitts of May Create, Jeff Porter, founder and CEO of Handbid, and Stephanie Mason, Handbid's Director of Product Development. Elevate your digital presence, drive engagement, and communicate your mission effectively with these tips.

Jeff: Welcome back to the Elevate Your Event podcast. Stephanie's going to do the intro this time because she just gave me all this advice on how to intro this podcast. So, Stephanie, welcome everybody.

Stephanie: Welcome back to the Elevate Your Event podcast. We are so pleased to have Monica with us. We're going to talk about marketing and branding and website design and how to break your website. I think we're going to have to throw that one in there.

Jeff: Yeah, I like that one because we've got some folks on our staff that are pretty good at that. But anyway, Monica, thanks for joining us. Tell us a little bit about your company. It's May Create. You said it right. Awesome. So tell us what you guys do and kind of how you got started. Basically, I think we'll at some point dive into what you guys do for nonprofits and events. But give us the whole story to start.

Monica: Well, I have a degree in agriculture. I put it to really good work building websites for people. I actually started my company because I was working for a marketing agency and every day I would walk up the steps and I was like, why am I walking up these steps? Why am I walking into this building? It's horrible. And then one day I was like, I'm just not going to anymore. And my mom took me on a walk and she said, honey, there is no time like the present to be hungry. I was 25. And that was 18 years ago. And she was right. She's like, you can live off peanut butter right now. It doesn't matter. Start your own business, do it. And so I did. And I called up a local business and I was like, hey, I hear you guys need somebody to help you out with your stuff. And they were like, yeah. And I'm like, I'll be your independent contractor. And they were like, okay. And that was my first client.

Jeff: Nice.

Monica: Yeah. So years later, we still build websites and we've dabbled in all kinds of other different types of online marketing and then quit doing them because what we really want to do is websites. And so, yeah, there you go. Websites.

Jeff: Awesome. And so do you do any aspect of the branding prior to the website, or are you working specifically with people that show up with a design and a brand and say, build this for me?

Monica: Most of our clients show up with a design and a brand, but we do have clients that show up without one. We do not tout ourselves as branding consultants. We are definitely designers, so we can make logos. And we have reasons why we make them certain ways. And we have a cool process that we take people through. But it's not our first point of entry for clients. I really love people to trust us to guide them through this logo-building process. So usually we start with the website and then once they see the website with their terrible logo on it, they're like, oh, okay. And we're like, yes. And so then they trust us and we take them through the logo design process too.

Jeff: And you know how attached nonprofits get to their logos? I've got some PTSD around that with some of my old charity.

Monica: We kind of did the same thing. I'm like, yeah, can we start with your logo? For a board, designing logos for boards -- there's a special place in heaven for designers who do that well, because it is tricky.

Jeff: Oh, it is, man. All the opinions.

Monica: You know, there's nothing like having your board design your logo or give you input on your brand or give you input on your event. God bless boards.

Jeff: We had a whole podcast episode on boards and the support groups around them. And I get to say all these things because I'm on a number of nonprofit boards, so I get to see the function and the dysfunction of them. But good for you guys. I mean, it's got to feel good. You're helping a nonprofit really reinvent themselves in certain ways, at least to the public, with how they present themselves. So talk a little bit about, at a high level, what your process is and what you walk them through. Obviously there's an element of colors and brand and design, but then there's the content as well and how the website should flow. Then we'll get a little technical in a bit, but start with that and then we can dive into what technologies you use and how you integrate it with other stuff and payments and all that kind of fun stuff.

Monica: We believe that a website is a marriage of form and function. So it has to be beautiful and inspiring, but it also has to work. It has to work for you. And it has to work for the people on the website. Where nonprofits get stuck is, well, actually everywhere. Because you get a volunteer and you're like, okay, this volunteer seems techy enough or they seem creative enough, and so they're going to build the website. And then you end up with a website, which is great because you have one. It might not do everything you want it to do, but you have a website. And then when that person moves on, then you have a website that no one knows how to use and nobody can even figure out how to log into. So one of our favorite things to do for nonprofits is, first off, help them plan the site that they really need that does the things that it's supposed to do for them. It's easy for them to use and looks beautiful. But then also, when their webmaster moves on, they still have us. And so the next person comes back to us and they're like, how do I log in? And we're like, right here, and here's your training video, and here's the person that you can talk to whenever you need help. So we really try to just kind of get them all taken care of in that way so that they're not just wandering around in the dark. Because the worst thing that can happen is that they just start all over again. That's such an energy suck. And they should be focusing on other things, not redesigning their website a million times.

Jeff: And why do you think they go to that as their go-to solution? Because I've been on a number of boards where it's like, I think we need to redesign the website. I'm like, well, let's identify what the problems are first that we're trying to solve. But in a lot of cases, they just kind of jump to that, don't they?

Monica: Yeah. I always tell them there are certain things a website can't fix. And I don't fix those things either. I'm a web designer. But let me introduce you to a few counselors that might be able to help. Or consultant. I'll be like, can you go talk to my friend over here who's a consultant who's going to get you on track, and then come back to me and we'll fix the stuff on your website. I don't think maybe the website's just the big shiny object. It's the communication portal. And so people think if they fix that, then the rest of it will come. But sometimes the things that you need to fix are not as obvious.

Jeff: No, it makes sense. And so how much are you guys getting involved in the actual content and the messaging and how you take them from one page to the next and the menu structure and all that kind of stuff?

Monica: Yeah, we plan all that out for them. And some of them we write every single word for the site. So yeah, we're very involved in it. And we're very passionate about how it works, how easy it is to use, how it loads, what people are going to feel when they're there, and if they're going to get to the next spot. We're always thinking our way through it. And we have a multi-step review process that we go through internally before we even send stuff out to clients, because our clients don't always know. They just see it and they're like, pretty done. And I'm like, well, pretty done is great. But we also need to have it be strategic and beautiful and functional. And so we have multiple people in our office that look over the stuff before it goes out to the client. So that way they can say pretty done, and we know it's actually very done and very effective.

Jeff: Yeah, it's called quality assurance.

Stephanie: Especially on the function side. I know I'm on a board -- we just got a new website. It is prettier, but the function is not any better than the previous website. There's definitely a gap in it because I'm like, yeah, it looks prettier, but the things that we're missing from the previous version are still missing.

Monica: And you see that a lot. It's because designers are designers and developers are developers. And you can merge them -- I have multiple that are hybrid humans on my staff -- but you also have to have a level of experience to get it to all come together. A lot of the times what I find when I take over websites is I'm like, oh look, they didn't know how to do that, and so they did it this way. Well, that's not coming over. So I find that sometimes we have designers who are really amazing but they don't know how to do the development, and so they'll gloss over it and do it another way that they can figure out, but that doesn't necessarily make it the right way, which makes it tricky.

Jeff: No, that totally makes sense. And now, do you start with their old website? Are you analyzing it? Are you doing heat maps on it? You're trying to figure out where people are going and then using that to inform the changes you make?

Monica: I don't use heat maps a lot of the time. Sometimes I do. It just depends on how big the organization is. If you've got a ton of traffic coming in, then that might be something I put in place. A lot of the times I'm looking at their old website and going, okay, what do you like about it? And also, what do you hate about it? What doesn't work? I look through the individual pages and click on every single thing and figure out how I feel going through it as a new person. And then I go to their tracking -- their Google Analytics and their Google Search Console. And I'm looking through all that information and going, are they ranking for the right words? Are people going to the pages I think they would go to? Are they staying on them long enough? What are they doing? I just try to make this picture in my head of what's actually happening out there between data and pictures. And then from there, I can be like, oh, did you know the most important thing on this page to people is actually nestled all the way in the bottom left or right corner? And we can move it all the way up to the top and give it to people. Or perhaps, since it's the third most visited page on your site, we just put a link to it on the homepage. We can do that. It's good fun.

Jeff: It's so helpful. As you're mentioning using data to inform where things need to go, I think a lot of businesses, nonprofits too, don't always realize they don't know that information. They just take their best guess or they browse the site the way they would normally browse it because they know their business so well and they don't really understand how people find things.

Monica: All the time. Happens all the time.

Stephanie: I think that also -- not just the browsing, but the understanding of the copy. I think that also happens with nonprofits and businesses. We're so familiar with our vocabulary. It makes sense to us. But it doesn't make sense to Billy Bob who comes to your site for the first time.

Jeff: And who's your audience? When I was with FPWR, the Foundation for Prader-Willi Research, we debated this a lot because you have different audiences coming to your site and you need to understand who they are and what jobs they need to do. We were a research organization issuing grants. So people would come to our site that were researchers and they needed to find the latest grant information. Then you have donors that come to your site and they know somebody with Prader-Willi. They just want to donate to a research project. And then you have families, maybe even a new diagnosis -- what is this disorder and how is it going to impact me? And so you kind of have to have those windows on the homepage. No one really thought about it that way until we really started to drill down and say, yes, we need to funnel people to the right spot.

Monica: So true. Because what does everybody do on their website? Like Donald Miller used to say, they talk about themselves. Look at us. We were founded in 2005. Look at how great we are. And people are like, I might care about you at some point, but I have some information I need.

Stephanie: Not yet.

Monica: I like to say that, especially for nonprofits, people are either going because they know what they need or they don't know what they need and they only know who they are. And so if your audience is someone who doesn't specifically know what they need, then we want to talk to our different audiences based on who they are and inform them of what you can do to meet their needs. Especially if you have an organization where people don't really understand your area of advocacy or they don't understand what you do because you have a new idea or maybe a new approach. They don't know that you solve this problem for the universe or that the problem even exists. And so in those cases, you need to add additional content to your website explaining why you exist because it's not obvious, and also talking to those individual humans about what you can do to help them based on who they are because they just don't know what they need yet.

Jeff: Totally makes sense. We're talking about this with events as well. Getting to the event site, it's like who's coming and what do they need? What job do they need to complete? Don't make it hard. Some of these event sites -- I went to one the other day. It was beautiful. But it was like this long intro video and it's like I just need to buy tickets. I already know I'm going. So how do I get past all this so I can just get to the ticket page? Or look, I'm not coming to the event. I'm sure it's going to be amazing. I just need to make my donation and move on.

Monica: And I think there's a lot of things on those event pages that you can think through that can inadvertently answer your audience's questions without even having to directly answer them. For example, if you're posting an event and it may be a more formal event, people don't know what to wear. So just post pictures of past events. That's all you have to do. Then they can see, oh look, people are in cocktail dresses or they're in formal gowns, because you want them to feel super comfortable and empowered when they come to your event. You don't want them to feel uncomfortable. Or think about it -- maybe parking is really a pain. Maybe it's the middle of the winter and it's going to be icy. So do you have a coat check? Do you have valet parking? Do you have the ability for people to drop off at the door? Is there a meetup area? How does parking work? Are there shuttles? Do you need to give them a map? Just think through these things and then put that information on the website so that everybody can find it.

Jeff: There's kind of two steps to what you said there. The first one is I have to actually think about those things. And then I actually have to provide answers and give them out to people. We did an event master class years ago and we took a lot of the things that we had witnessed at events over the years and said, it actually surprises me the things that people don't necessarily do. Like, think about what it's going to be like to drive downtown Denver on a Friday at six -- you say you start at six o'clock sharp on a Friday and it's black tie, well that's just not going to happen for people who get off work at five. Or where are they going to park? I've made some of those mistakes at my own event sometimes because you get so wrapped up and you're like, you're just going to park there -- but you don't realize that what's over there on a Tuesday is not available on a Saturday or vice versa. So, yeah, I love what you're saying. Make the stuff that I need to know right away front and center.

Monica: Yeah, but it's just got to be easy. Even the registration form -- there are times where people subscribe to a site that's really fancy, and then the registration form makes no sense. And you get to it and you're like, I don't know what this is. I don't understand why I have to create an account. I don't understand why I have to give my blood type. I am freaked out. I am leaving. I'm not signing up. And then on the other hand, you could have gone way simpler. It has to be super easy. If it's not easy, it's not good.

Jeff: And if you need certain information, you kind of have to explain to people why.

Stephanie: I agree. Because sometimes there's a reason for it, but other times there's not. The stuff that I hate is especially around event registration or the whole process of getting through a task. You make it onerous and then you make it even more onerous because it's like, okay, I've now created your account. I'm just trying to buy tickets, okay? Created your account. Now go to your email, leave this entire flow that you're in, go to your email and click on this verification code.

Jeff: And there was one site -- I should not pick on them, they're one of our competitors. But it was funny. They said it could take up to 30 minutes to get this code. I'm actually at the event. So for the next 30 minutes, I can't bid in this auction because I'm not going to get this email code. Just stuff like that bothers me. Make it simple. Obviously, if there's a security reason or a data privacy reason that you need certain information, totally get it. And the rules are changing daily. But make it as simple as you legally and practically can.

Monica: Absolutely. And obviously as the organization you're going to want some information about who's coming because you want to keep in touch with those people, you want to nurture those relationships, and you want to provide them with information going forward. So you will want some information -- that's fantastic. But you've got to be clear about it and it's got to be in a common-sense, logical way.

Jeff: And your developers are no different than ours in the sense that they probably are like, I just have to solve this problem, I got to complete this task. And once they're done building it, the best thing is to make them actually go back and use it. People ask, why do you take your developers to your events? I'm like, because I'm going to make them check in 100 people and then they're going to get it.

Monica: Yes. 100 percent. And I can't tell you the number of times where they've been like, no, no, no, this was the best way, the most time-effective way to solve the problem. I'm like, I am trying to train a client how to use this site and I just had to enter the same information in four places. That does not work for me. We just have to redo this because it is not happening. And I don't care what you say. I'm not taking no for an answer on that one. We're fixing it.

Jeff: Exactly. It's got to be easy. So do you guys do all of the development and hosting as well, or do you set them up with a host or install it for them, maintain it for them, all of the above?

Monica: Yes. Well, we don't have a data center anymore. We used to have one and then we actually demerged with the company that managed the data center. So we ended up moving to another hosting platform and we love them. They're super responsive. So we have a relationship with a hosting platform that we set everything up on and they pay us for hosting so that way they don't have to deal with it basically. And then when something is a challenge, then it's our responsibility to fix it and get it right for them. And then we set it up. We have what we call our Safe Site Plan where we go in and update everything for them and take care of all their plugins and stuff because they get to use all of the professional-level programs and so forth that we buy.

Jeff: That's nice. It's hard to keep up with all those plugin updates and the security vulnerability alerts that come out. So that's nice you guys do that for your clients.

Monica: Yep. And then they call us when they need us, which is most of the time. Annually, we go through most of our websites and we're like, hey, did you know that you still have a Twitter icon when you have an X icon? Or hey, did you know that your this or that is now busted because it hasn't been updated in five years? Because stuff just happens. Bootstrap updates and all the code updates and everything changes, Google changes. We just make sure that we keep in contact with everybody, and when everything changes, then it makes for some really interesting weeks for our staff.

Jeff: I bet. Now, for nonprofits, let's talk about the commerce side of this. Are you helping them integrate with a CRM? Are you putting up your own donation pages, or typically what would you have work in there for your clients?

Monica: The first thing is it's different for everyone because I believe there's no one solution. It has to be the right thing for you. So some nonprofits come to us and they already have a donor management system and it's got to interface with something. Some of those donor management systems have online donation forms that I can just put the code into their website for. Some of them have beautiful ready-made donation pages that we can just link out to. So it all depends. And then others, say they don't have a donor management system but they're thinking about one and they just need something really simple in their website. Then there's a plugin that we work with called GiveWP that does a great job for that as an entry-level donor management system. And then for others, they're like, we don't care. We're just going to use a spreadsheet. That's how we manage everything. And for them, we're just going to hook them up with a Stripe account and build all their forms for them and make sure that it sends to everybody and that they can do everything they need. So it's really just, once again, that marriage of form and function. I want you to have something that's beautiful and slick, and it has to fit in with what you've got and where you're at growing your organization.

Jeff: That's awesome. And it sounds right. It's interesting to us to see where people are at, everything from a Google spreadsheet to something elaborate like a Blackbaud or a Bloomerang. We see everything in between as well.

Stephanie: I just got out of a board meeting before coming to this podcast. And we were talking about the simplicity of making a donation. We were just talking about it with us, like the simplicity of finding what I need on an event page. And the complaint, because we're just a regional chapter of a very large national organization who is imposing a really onerous donation form -- that's just tough. You have to fill it out every time. It's not like it even remembers you. And I threw out this concept, which everybody got excited about -- the concept of a one-click donation. We've got to get to a one-click donation.

Jeff: Thank you for joining us for part one about nonprofit websites. Be sure to join us for part two as we discuss some practical tips and do's and don'ts for nonprofit websites. If you enjoyed our show, please take a moment to leave us a review. You can find us on Apple, Google, and Spotify. Don't forget to subscribe for more great content. And if you're a fan of video, check us out on YouTube. Until next time, happy fundraising.